EN450 FRONT END CONVERSION

[mshaw7]

Hi could anyone tell me what forks I could use to lower front end
of my EN450 1985

Cheers
Matt

[geezyrider]

Uh.......................you wanna do what??

[bigandrew85]

Welcome to the site Matt, I'm not sure myself, I do know theres at least one that fits but im not sure if its any shorter
Eagle should know

[chopperfreak2k1]

both 37mm and 36mm tubes will fit the trees if that helps

[mshaw7]

nice one, just dont like look front end saw a guy who hard tailed his and he had shorter forks which looked great

Thanks all

[eaglerider]

The 454 forks are about 34 or 35 inches, just measure other 36 & 37 mm forks.

[skatetokil]

Also, before you go dropping money on a new set of forks, you could just drop the current ones in the trees and see how it changes the handling. Does anybody know what the stock steering angle is on these bikes? It's not in my clymer manual.

I did find a craigslist ad for the bike which lists the following specs but take them with a grain of salt:

Front fork/wheel travelShowa air-spring, 36mm stanchion tube diameter/5.8in
(147mm)
Rear shock/wheel traveldual Showa shocks, 5 position adjustable spring
pre-load/4.5in (115mm)
Wheelbase58.1 to 59.1 in (1476 to 1502mm)
Seat height29.3 in (745mm)
Weight427lbs (193.7kg)
Steering head angle.31.5degrees from vertical
Front wheel trail 5.47in (139mm)

This would suggest that you could safely lower the forks by 30mm without going into the realm of scary quick handling, maybe even a bit more. Sportbikes have steering head angles in the low to mid 20s and rakes of 90mm+ but often have steering dampers fitted to avoid tankslappers. High 20s would probably be pretty neutral.

I'm not really a "cruiser guy" and the front end looks really long to me too.

I have to believe that you could build a much more nimble, high performance bike by lowering the front slightly while raising the rear. However, a set of 17inch wheels and sticky tires front and rear might be better place to start. Anyone got pics of a 454 with a wheel swap?

[eaglerider]

Now guys, I just might tick someone off here - but that is not my intention or goal......From what I gather from some of these posts, you are sportbike riders, and have very limited, or no cruiser knowledge. The 454 is Not a sportbike - it is a cruiser, although it does basically have a sportbike engine. If you wanted a sportbike, you should buy one, or trade your 454 for one. The 454 was never ment to be a sportbike. There is a whole lot of difference the two types of bikes. There is a lot of difference in the steering geometry between the two types of bikes. When messing with steering geometry, there are a lot of things that come into play, and when making drastic, or even minor changes, you can really mess things up. Trying to compare them is about like comparing apples to oranges - they are very different. On GWKs website, in the left sidebar, there is an article on steering geometry - rake & trail. Now that I have said all this, consider carefully what your "wants & intents" are, before diving in, and possibly creating something that could be a danger to you and even others, and mainly screwing up a good bike, trying to make it into something that it is not.

[skatetokil]

Warning is duly noted, but I'm not a sportbike rider, I'm a dirtbiker! But you're right, my primary concern is having a bike that handles well in the city and on backroads at moderate speed. I'm willing to give up some all day superslab comfort and straight line stability to do that. But I got this bike for free, I like to tinker, and I kind of like the look of it. So I'm going to see if I can't make it do what I want it to do. Isn't that the point here? Making the best of what we've got to work with and customizing it to fit our intended use?

I do find it interesting that when people come on and talk about chopping down their frames so they have 45 degrees of rake or dropping their rear shocks so the bike scrapes on the ground nobody bats an eye. I don't want to disparage anybody's choice of wheels, but those guys are clearly sacrificing rideability for the sake of having a bike that looks really cool. And that's fine, provided they know the limits of the bike and ride within them.

You won't catch me out on the interstate on my yz125 smoker with saddlebags hanging off it. It would be a bad idea. Just like trying to turn a 454 into a racebike is a bad idea.

However, I know plenty of people who do supermoto conversions and have dual sport 125s. It works for the kind of riding they want to do. Are they crazy? Maybe, but at least they are riding.

[eaglerider]

Understood, skate, but you do not know this bike, and what it will do. It is not a "straight-line" bike, it is a very nimble bike. I would suggest you learn about this bike before you have any pre-concieved ideas about it. The 454 has really fooled a lot of folks...including me, when I first got mine.

[chopperfreak2k1]

ditto that Eagle. i think the 454 is a bike that kinda offers the best of both worlds sport bike/cruiser. JMO

[eaglerider]

;D ;D Pretty well said, Chopper!

[skatetokil]

I mean, I'd say it falls into the "sport cruiser" category (along with the magna, eliminator, Piglet etc) which is why I find it appealing. But there are compromises with any design, and on this bike the tall skinny front tire and long fork are obviously aesthetic tips of the hat to chopper styling rather than functional performance enhancing features.

All other things being equal, the more weight you get over the front wheel in a corner, the less likely you are to have the front end wash out. All other things being equal, a smaller, lighter wider front wheel changes direction quicker and grips better. If these are things you care about, there are modifications you can do to improve performance in this regard on any two wheeled vehicle whether it's a cruiser, sportbike, dirtbike, or bicycle.

[mshaw7]

Thanks guys lots to think about with all your knowledge glad I bought a 450 and even better found this site cheers

[chopperfreak2k1]

i don't think i would call the 454 a sport cruiser cuz sport cruisers have a more upright seating position. the seating position of the 454 is all cruiser. IMHO

[eaglerider]

Actually, u cannot get much more upright on the 454. Now, there are bikes that are mostly sportbikes that do have raised handlebars, and re-positioned footpegs, that are referred to as "sportcruisers". My son owned a Yamaha (I don't recall the model) that was this way.

[chopperfreak2k1]

maybe i'm not conveying the right idea here. when i think of a sport cruiser i think magna amd the like. when i think cruiser i think savage, intruder, 454 LTD, etc. and the magna's seat sits lower then a standard but not as low as the 454. to me at least, this is how it seems.

[eaglerider]

Ok, thats cool, but technically, what I described are sport cruisers, the rest (except for the sport bikes or "crotch-rockets)are cruisers. 'Course, then there are the tourers, sport tourers, dual-purpose & on, & on.......sometimes it gets confuzzin!! LOL But mostly, I call the magna, Hardly dav, & the others similar to ours..cruisers, but thats me. It was more simple before sport bikes...Ya had just motorcycles.....street bikes & dirt bikes....the sport bikes came about when the race bikes got real popular, and somebody wanted a bike that looked like the racers, to ride on the street....ergo, the dawn of sport bikes.
O, just to confuse the issue, take a look at the Yamaha Warrior (not the 4 wheeler atv)...it is (supposedly) for those that can not decide if they wanted a sport bike or a cruiser. It is a 1700CC CRUISER....forward controls, looks like (is)a cruiser, but has a bit of sport bike technology & feel to it. It also only weights about 650 lbs....so 650 lbs, 102 cubic inch, fuel injected engine (with a number of performance options....means FAST! Was 5 time drag champion bike for its class. My sone bought one, I rode it.....MERCY!!!!

[skatetokil]

So I tested my handling theory a bit today....

Went out and turned the preload collars on the rear shocks to the stiffest position and dropped the front about an inch and a half in the trees. Hardly radical modifications, but the front end felt noticeably more planted in corners. I really kind of like the way the bike rides now, though I'm a pretty big guy and the cockpit feels a little bit cramped to me.

Anybody else 6'3+? What did you do to to get comfortable? I'm considering rebending the bars a bit but I don't want to weaken them.

[eaglerider]

6'3" ? Skate, gotta tell ya.....the 454 will never feel real comfortable to you.....it is too "short-coupled" (too short of a wheelbase), for real tall persons.

[shujump]

I'll agree, I think at 6'3" it will be hard to get the 454 to be comfortable in the stock set up. At 6' myself (with long extremeties) my knees are pretty much at the grips with the stock set up. I did find it a little better to replace the stock handle bars with a straight set that helped me stretch out my arms a little bit more and get my hands away from my knees. I've seen some 454s with highway pegs that I bet would be pretty comfortable for those longer rides on the highways.

[zekkfett]

Mar 18, 2010 22:03:27 GMT -6 skatetokil said:

So I tested my handling theory a bit today....

Went out and turned the preload collars on the rear shocks to the stiffest position and dropped the front about an inch and a half in the trees. Hardly radical modifications, but the front end felt noticeably more planted in corners. I really kind of like the way the bike rides now

Any other details? Any way we can get pictures? I'm thinking of doing the exact same thing, just need a lil positive feedback from someone that has tried this. Thanks!

[originalhandy]

I dunno I am not far of 6'3" (I am 6'2") and find the 454 very comfortable to ride. If I get cramped I get off her for 30 minutes or so and go again.

[Gonester]

I am 5'10, 135Lbs, also long extremities, and I find this bike to be a little cramped. long rides make my knees hurt, since I don't have highway bars. If I had the shop to build a set of forward controls at, I defintely would.

[ride]

I have ordered 34 inch broom stick handle bars,Had to fit razes to clear the tank i went 2 inch. Ordered 10 1/2 inch rear shocks this will bring the rear guard down level with the Tyre also thinking of moving the foot pegs, once I have it done will try to post photos.

[joenson]

I know this is a pretty old topic, but anyway..

I am 6' and I feel like I'm at the maximum size for this bike.
I would like to reach lower and further forwards than I do with my T-bar, to keep my fingers warm spring and fall and to keep my bottom happy, so I considered lowering the tripple on the tubes and put clamp-on handlebars at the top of the tubes.
_

By the way.. I sometimes take a ride with some younger guys from work.
They like to go pretty fresh on the 'corners' on the twisted country roads - but I've always been able to keep up with them. ;D

I'm amazed how well this bike handles, and the motor... It's the best.!

It's a fantastic bike that we own.! I've had only sports-/sportstouring bikes before, mostly 750's, but this one is the one that I've had the most fun/pleasure of driving.
I'll NEVER sell my 454.. That's for sure..! ;D

[Jet⚡Black]

I am at 6' on the dot too last I checked and the controls even though already a bit forward feel like mids sitting on it...if you like knuckles and toes out change bars and put forwards on it? I personally don't like that position I prefer the feel of mids, But I don't want to be all cramped and crumpled up on things either.

Tossing the Fonzie bars will get your elbows out of your ribs in slow walk turns and allow a more upright sit when riding. You'd be surprised at how much just the handle bars change it up.

The 454 is a sport cruiser one of the very first ones actually; trying to compare it to newer bikes getting called sport cruiser, is like saying your grand pa looks like you when in fact you look like your grand pa...since he was around first.

Edit to add... www.allballsracing.com/index.php/forkconversion use this site to find swappable front ends...you just have to watch out for stem length, using that chart so if you like a front end listed as a swap do some research on it for stem length.